Mastering Cash Flow and Entrepreneurial Success | Essential Tips for Self-Employed Agents

Market Insights:
James shares a mixed week with both successes and challenges. Positive sentiment in the market with increased viewings and offers. Jack notes an uptick in viewings and sales over the bank holiday weekend.

Partner Success Stories:
Jack’s productive week in Solihull with partner agent Emily. High-value listings secured, showcasing the success of quality marketing. Collaboration with new partner Ben, leading to significant listings and a shift in fee strategy.

Topic of the Day: Cash Flow Management
Importance of a personal survival budget and cash flow forecast. Strategies for raising funds to start a self-employed business. Discussion on the necessity of a robust business plan. Agreement on the need for clear planning to ensure financial stability.

Entrepreneurial Mindset:
The importance of enjoying the process and not just focusing on results. Strategies for maintaining momentum and avoiding the lead generation rollercoaster. The benefits of raising funds through loans versus part-time jobs.

Final Thoughts:
The importance of clarity and a supportive community. Encouragement for those feeling trapped in their current roles to seek advice and explore self-employment.

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Transcript

So we're back for another episode of the Elite Agent Masterclass with myself, James Humphrey-Stone, and co-host Jack Durkin. How are you, mate? Very good, mate. Very good. Thank you. How are you? Yeah. Do you know what? All good. All good. Busy week. Easter has Fran Spanner in the works. I think April... It's that typical spring thing, isn't it? Well, for me personally, in my local business, it's that spring thing. I'm seeing as many vows this week as well. Last month I saw 16. This week I'm seeing nine. So I'm seeing 50 percent of what I saw last month in a week. So it seems that April has come off to a flyer. How about you? Yeah, pretty similar. And mate, just before we touch onto that, you were another year older, aren't you? After the bank holiday weekend. Yeah, I thought we'd move. I thought we'd just slide straight past that. But yeah, another year older, mate. Another year older. Did you do anything the weekend? Yeah, do you know what? It was good. I spent the day with the family. We had a little bit of a day trip. We only live like 15 minutes from Matlock and Matlock Bath. Matlock Bath is, I think if my information stands me right, is the biggest inland resort. It's like going to the seaside, but with no sea. So it's like you've got fish and chips, you've got arcades, you've got ice cream shops. And it was a nice day. It was probably the first day of the year that we've actually had glorious sunshine all day. So instead of driving into Matlock, we got the train in with the kids, a little bit of fun for them. They're only three and two, so they love a little bit of an adventure on the train. And then in the evening, I had my first experience of ice hockey. Went to the Nottingham Panthers. Hayley organised that. That was wicked. Let's go, Panthers. I'm a fan now. Good stuff. A bit of downtime. I think it's important, isn't it? I feel exactly the same as you, Matt, in April. Sorry, March is a really busy month and April is looking like it's going to be the same. But it was nice to get a bit of downtime. And over the weekend, it sounds like you did as well. Yeah. Refresh the batteries. How was your week last week then? Do you know, mixed bag, we had a sale fall through. It's a little bit, I don't want to say cursed, but we've sold it two or three times. And it's never been the house that we've sold that's been the problem. It's been the chain that it's connected to. And one thing or another has then gone wrong in the chain. So we just had to go back to market on that for, I think, the fourth time, maybe the fifth. So that's quite frustrating. But we exchanged on a couple. We've got a really good one due to exchange this week. We got confirmation last week that that should cross the line. So that's all good. March was a good month in the main. We listed some really good properties, getting some great levels of viewings. I don't know about you, but we're getting good viewing numbers at the minute. Lots of offers coming in as well. So on the positive side, I feel there's a lot of positive sentiment in the market. Yeah, we're getting a lot of viewings, I think, but... I'll be quite honest, the last few weeks, probably the last three weeks, we had a lot of sales at the start of March. The back end of March, probably the last couple of weeks, not so much. We had a lot of viewings over the bank holiday weekend, which I was surprised about because sometimes the bank holiday weekend can be a little bit quiet with people going away. But we had one property that had been on with another agent for, it's been on with them for eight months. They had five viewings with other agents in those eight months. And we had seven viewings last Saturday and we got another four this coming weekend. So it's, I think our marketing's helped, but I think also the market, I'm hoping, is starting to pick up now as well as we head into the spring and summer months. But I also spent a good week last week over in Solihull, which was a little bit different, but also very, very enjoyable. So I spent a lot of time with Emily, one of our partner agents who's looking after Sully Hall and went out to see a couple of properties with her, spent a bit of time in their local business and it's generated two high value listings. One that is signed and sealed, the other one that we spoke to yesterday and yeah, it looks like it's going to be coming on. Great listings too by the sound of things, aren't they? Yeah, really nice. Really nice. Two with probably the top five roads within the Solihull area. One at 1.85 mil and the other offers over 1.25 mil. Just had the marketing back at the one at 1.25 and it looks incredible. And you mentioned the video with me last night. I have to say, Emily's what now? Eight weeks into her launch. So to have... Two listings, one signed, one just about to sign, but two listings in two of the top five roads in the area. That is some going from a launch. But yeah, I saw the marketing. And if that doesn't attract some serious attention from local buyers of houses to sell, I will be surprised. Yeah, I'm hoping it's going to lead to a fair few opportunities for her. Yeah, like I said, two really, really nice properties in two really nice roads. Both, in fact, overlooking golf courses at the back. So yeah. I have to go there for a round then. Yeah, maybe on the next one's take on, we'll have to book in a round of golf during the take on. Nice. That's a good result. So you obviously spent some time with Emily. I also went out with one of our partners local to me on Friday, Good Friday. So I was off Saturday, Sunday, Monday, but Good Friday, we went and did a vow together. I had been recommended on it, but obviously it's Ben's area. So I said, look, let's do it together. If it comes on the market, then it's a great opportunity. Similar to Emily in so much as it's a great location. It's a really, really good main road board. One of the main access roads in and out of the area. And an absolutely beautiful house on the market at the minute. And the marketing, after seeing the house in person and then reflecting back on the marketing, I was like, they are being let down badly. The marketing is terrible. But we met up for coffee just beforehand yesterday. And obviously, Ben's a new launch. He's what now? Six. This is his sixth week into business. So we're first week of April, his sixth week into partnering with us. He's built a really good, steady flow of incoming leads. For example, we saw, I think, six hours last week. I think he's got three or four more this week, which is really, really steady. But we met for a coffee beforehand to kind of talk through the plan and the strategy with the client we were meeting. And I said to him, look, you know, obviously I'm going online. to ideally steer them more towards working with you because it's your area, it makes more sense. So if you want to leverage against my fees, but you do it more of a showcase and potentially more of a favourable rate because you're new just to get the wheels turning, then feel free. What sort of fee would you want to look to put in play? Bearing in mind his 2% or 1.5 with £500 marketing fee up front. And his initial reaction was... 1% or 0.8 with 500 upfront. And I said, come on, mate. I think that we can push that because I do believe that what you offer is far more valuable than that. And they're going to see that. So why don't we go with one and a half or 1.25 with 500 upfront? He's like, okay, let's do it. And they're coming on. They're booked for the 11th marketing visit, contract signed. So it was interesting that it was almost a half a percent difference between that one conversation. That one conversation was half a percent difference. And the only difference had, it was nothing to do with the delivery. It was nothing to do with the marketing campaign. It was nothing to do with anything to do with us. It was all between the ears and the mindset. And he said afterwards, that for me felt like a bit of a lesson almost that, just need to back up and believe in what we deliver and that I'm worth more because that is more you know in that area I worked it for three years the area that he's in the average fee maxes out at one percent And to be fair, that's probably similar in a lot of other areas as well, isn't it? I think the good thing with that, I get where Ben's coming from because he's a new launch business. He doesn't want to lose it. He wants to win the business. He wants to generate opportunities. And by the way, it's a beautiful house in a great location. So I get it. Sometimes you look at it and go, it's a lost leader. I get it. Yeah, very similar to the one that me and Emily went out to as well. Really wanted it because of the road, because of the prestigious road and what it's going to lead to and the opportunities that it's going to generate from it. After we spoke to the client, and our fees were the highest out of all the other agents, and we have had to negotiate a little bit on it to win it. But we just said to the client, look, if fees weren't... everyone's fees were the same who would you want to work with and they said us and then we started to explain all the additional stuff that we're doing and then it kind of justified the fee so yeah what a result though what result for ben Great. A great week all round. Great week all round. And today, I guess that leads nicely into because of the talk of fees and what have you. It leads nicely into cash flow. Cash flow is the topic of the masterclass today. And I think we did briefly discuss this before we came online, didn't we? And I want the audience to understand that actually we do have a little bit of a conversation before each pod. but it's not planned out as such. And the reason I'm sharing that is that Jack and I, on some of the topics we're going to discuss today, we don't always agree. And I believe that to be very healthy, because if we agreed on everything, we're just going to become yes men to each other and the business comes to a standstill. So this one is the one where I think we have the most topics where we're like, not sure I 100% agree with the other person's opinion. Would you agree with that? Yeah, I think I said briefly before we click record that there might be a bit of a difference in opinion on a couple of topics when it comes to cash flow. And I suppose I don't think there's any right or wrong. It's just an opinion. There's evidence of things that work in certain areas and certain things that work in other areas as well. So it'll be good to discuss it and unpack it and see whether we do agree or we disagree on some of the points that we discuss. We wrote a little bit of a list down. I don't think we'll do it in chronological order just because I guess topics will come up and we'll go off in different directions on those topics. I think one of the best places to start is either raising the funds to start in the first place or the cost of setting up. Where do you want to start first? To be fair, I think both are incorporated into one. I think a lot of people, when they're looking at the self-employed model, the first question people have is, how do I get started or how do I get the funds to get started? So I suppose it's probably, yeah, how to get started and how to raise the funds is probably the first question. and we'll probably answer the second question in that on how much does it cost or what sort of costs are needed to get set up. So yeah, I suppose we've... There's a couple of ways, isn't there, to set up? And I think to get set up, you're going to have to have some budget behind you. I think firstly, it's really important to understand what your monthly personal outgoings are going to be. Because let's face it, it's going to be six months before you're likely to get your first completion. We've had agents that have had them sooner. We've had agents that have taken a little bit longer. But on the main, I think as a whole, you're probably looking at six months before you get your first completion land. So you need some funds available for those first six months. Yeah, a personal survival budget. I think that's quite an important thing to touch on, isn't it? Because when we refined our processes at the end of last year, didn't we? And I think one of the main things that we integrated into our onboarding process was, or prior to the onboard, is going for a personal survival budget with our partners to ensure that they can financially support themselves and then have a form of capital should they need it to invest into their business um and then having a bit of a cash flow forecast to understand what the finances could look like what runway they've got then a basic business plan to see where they're starting where they want to go and then the final piece is then having a blueprint we it's our 90-day plan but a blueprint for how you're going to achieve that plan that business plan um I think that personal survival budget was quite a big inclusion because people are then looking at things slightly differently and saying, okay, well, if I did this now, how does that impact down the road? yeah yeah and I think also you can you can say there's a certain number a certain amount that you've got that you can start your business off with but then if it's a a random amount then how does that break down I think it's really important to break that down month by month on how much you can need whether that's enough of what you need or whether um it's more than what you need so I think it's really important I think the survival budget does that doesn't it I suppose when you're looking to get funding as a new business, you need to have all these things in place. So I think it's really important that if you are going to be partnering with any self-employed model that you have these things in place before you launch a cash flow budget, a business plan. And the survival budget as well, looking at your personal outgoings, having a robust plan before you get set up, I think is really, really important. That's quite a daunting prospect. You know, I'm sitting there and I'm thinking to myself, if I was starting out and someone is suggesting that I need to have all those things in place, especially if I've been in an employed world. Actually, I would argue that many of the self-employed brands out there don't have that in place for their partner. agents and their self-employed entities so actually it's quite daunting to I've got to build a business plan I've got to do cash flow I've got to like that feels like a lot um but actually it's not that complicated is it and and I suppose one of the big things for us that we're pretty proud of is the fact that we will help people work through that so we've done it enough times now that I couldn't do it in my sleep I'm not far from being able to in so much as they just need to give me the figures and I can then help them plug that in um But it could seem quite daunting to have all that. But would you say that's quite a foundational thing that people should be having in place if they're going to launch a self-employed business? Yeah, 100%. I think it's shown as well with the agents that we've had this year that have been through that process and the success that they're now seeing. I think... Really, really important. I think planning and preparing for anything will help you succeed in any aspect of life. And I think making sure that you spend the time, because it's going to be a little bit time consuming at the start, but making sure that you spend the time to plan out the business planning, the cash flow forecast, the survival budget. Planning that out at the start is going to massively increase your chances of being able to kickstart your business quicker and generate cash flow a lot quicker as well, I think. I suppose the key there is clarity breeds confidence, doesn't it? If you've got clarity over your direction of travel, you've got clarity over your finances, you've got clarity over what needs to be done in order to get you from where you are today to where you want to be, then your level of confidence is going to be far greater. Yeah, and then it's just down to the agent then to deliver it. They know what they need to do. They know what they've got to do. It's just out there and deliver it. Because I think you can spend a lot of time overthinking things and deciding whether what you're going to do is the right decision or deciding which way to take the business. But if you've got a robust plan at the very start, then you know exactly what you've got to do. It's just time to go out there and deliver. Just go and deliver. Do the boringly consistent stuff that we talk about a lot. So go on, then. If it takes six months for the first one, really, on average, for the first deal to cross the line and to bank, how much should somebody be putting into their personal survival budget? How much money do they need to financially support themselves? Not how much financially, but how many months worth of income or money do they need banked? I think it's dependent really, isn't it, on lifestyle and what their personal outgoings are. But I would say it could be anything from 10 to 20,000. No, no, sorry, I probably misarticulated. So forget, it's more, so let's for argument's sake, say someone's outgoings are two grand a month, for argument's sake. how many months, so forget the financial number, how many months would you suggest they need to have? In my opinion, I think they should, if it's taking on average six months to bank your first completion, I personally think that someone should have eight to nine months in the bank so that if they did no business for eight to nine months, they can survive at home. Yeah, yeah, I'd agree. Do you agree with that? The next bit that you led on to is then... I dived into it. You sort of did, is... How much do you think they need in that first six to nine months in terms of investing back into their own business? This is where I don't necessarily think we 100% agree. I think there's a lot of stuff you can do. It'd be nice to have a budget to set for marketing budget, but there are ways of doing it without having to need that marketing budget. I would say it'd be nice to have £500 a month to invest into your business, but it can be done on little to no budget as well. Yeah. Do you know what? £500 a month, if you start breaking back what could go into that, that's a lot of output, which is good because obviously, you know, if it was over the course of a year, that's 6k you've got to play with. But £500, if you start to put that into context, I'm rewinding the clock to when we launched our local businesses. And I was spending no more than probably £100 a week on social media ad campaigns. I think the big outlay for me, but it was also the biggest return, was direct mail. But I chose to be time efficient rather than cash efficient because I had put some money aside, I'd sold an asset, I'd raised some finance as well, taken a business loan. So I put myself in a position where I could put more budget in But the point I'm getting at there is direct mail doesn't need to come at great expense because it can then be hand-delivered. Yeah, and I suppose I did it a little bit differently, I think. Although I had a bit of funds, a bit of savings, I still wanted to go out there and keep the cost relatively low. So I went out and door knocked. I did a lot of hand delivered letters. One also because I just enjoyed getting up in the morning, gave me something to do, go out for a walk. And I thought, why not just hand deliver the letters whilst I'm out walking as well. So that was really low cost for me to get get those letters out there and create those opportunities. I think I'm pretty sure we still spent some money on marketing as well to build our credibility up on the social media platforms as well. So that was probably where we put our budget when we first launched was into the social media campaigns and then letters and door knocks and other networking events were very low cost. I mean, the other thing that it leads into as well, because obviously at The Avenue, we have the motto of never the biggest, always the best. And when it comes to our marketing, we want to ensure that it is the very best level. So we invest in professional marketing, videography, photography. So that's a cost. But what we have done is created a space for the partners to essentially, I guess, have that confidence to deliver an upfront marketing fee. So like then on Friday with this particular client, giving them customer two choices, there's a number of reasons why that's quite valuable. Psychologically, it means that if they've had free agents, this particular client hadn't. But if they had, then by offering two choices, you become 50% of the choice making that they need to make. Because the other agents generally are only offering one a piece, right? So there's four options on the table, you're 50%. But the other thing is, from a cash flow point of view, I'm recognizing that more clients prefer to go with the upfront marketing fee and get a slightly more reasonable percentage. And so that then just pays for all of my professional marketing without me needing to dip into my cash flow. Yeah. The other thing I feel it does as well is it shows the seller's commitment. It shows the sellers are committed because they're putting forward some of the investment as well. So, yeah, I really like the split fees, giving two options as well, because you can always, if you've worked your numbers out beforehand, you can also make it favourable of the one that you want them to go with. So if you are in a business and you want the upfront marketing fees and just make that a little bit more attractive than the no sale, no fee and everything on the back end. That's exactly why I've created a half a percent difference, because I would prefer for the slightly lower percentage, but with the upfront marketing fee to cover my upfront costs. So I've weighted it like that, but as time goes on, it may well shift and I might say, well, actually, I'm quite happy to swallow that into my cash flow. And so I'll shift it. So the gap is only a quarter of a percent, making the higher fee more favorable. So you can massage that in any which way you want it to go to suit your stage in your business journey. But I do think the upfront marketing fee, again, it's a psychological barrier. And if you ask a lot of estate agents, do you think clients would be prepared to commit? The answer, if we polled it, did a poll on LinkedIn and said, do you think clients would be prepared to commit to an upfront marketing fee? I reckon the lion's share of agents would probably say no. But the reality is that people are willing to make that contribution if they're committed to the move. And they believe in you and your strategy and your marketing and the result. Yeah, I think that's the key. If they're confident that you can deliver them the result, then there's no reason why I think they would back out of a one-inch payout for a marketing fee. Especially if there's an option to have a slightly lower fee on the back end, then it's going to be more favourable to do that. So I think... Upfront marketing fees are a great way to make sure that you can provide the best quality of marketing, but also help your cash flow. And also, in terms of lead generation as well, there's so many different lead generation strategies that don't cost money or cost very little money. So I think that can help with cash flow in the early days if you haven't got the money to invest thousands of pounds into marketing spend. So really, then we didn't actually disagree because the number actually lined up because we weren't talking. As soon as you put personal survival budget to one side, what they need to survive for some people, it could be a thousand pound a month. For others, it could be eight grand a month. So we can't really estimate that. All we can say is, in my opinion, and it seems you agree, if you've got eight to nine months worth that can help you, if you did nothing for the next eight to nine months, but you've got enough money in the bank to pay your bills for that period, then you're good. And then the budget that goes into your business could be anywhere. I think it could be as little as £100 a month. And it doesn't really need to be a great deal more than £500 a month, does it? Because especially in the early stages of launch, 95% of what agents will be doing is going out and sourcing opportunities. So they have got the time. to be able to hand deliver those letters to the specific types of properties that they want to sell. They have got the time to do everything themselves. And as time goes on, that time allocation has to change. I think one of the biggest and most important things there, though, is that there's a plan. Again, it's in the business plan. There's a plan that when you hit that moment where you're like, do you know what? I'm getting quite a steady flow of leads now. It's really, really important that agents don't fall into the age old trap of I've got plenty of leads. I'll dial down my output. I'll stop spending money on marketing. I will do less because I'm getting leads. And then what ends up happening is the roller coaster starts taking its dip. And then all of a sudden it's like, oh, bugger, I've lost all my opportunities. I've got to go out there and source a load more. My attitude would be if you gain your momentum, double your budget. Yeah. And also just making sure you can do things consistently, because like you said, we've seen it time and time again, where you'll have a lot of leads, a lot of opportunities and you turn the tap off and then you're having to pedal again. And it could be another couple of months when you try and turn the tap back on before you're going to start to see the results two, three months before you see the results again. So I'm living, breathing proof of that. I did go on that roller coaster. I did allow myself to fall into that trap of thinking, oh, there's a nice steady flow of leads now. and dial it back a little bit in terms of my output. And it hurt me for a three-month period. I had a 90-day period where because of my output dropping in the previous 90 days, I was thinking I've got loads of opportunities, loads of deals coming through. All of a sudden, okay, my well has run dry of leads. And now I've learned my lesson. I've had my fingers burnt by rolling and I'm not prepared to do it. You know, I'm in a phase at the minute where, like I say, we saw 16 vows last month. We listed nine. That's quite a high number considering our average fee in our local business. We're quite ordinarily happy with listing four or five a month and seeing 10 to 12 MAs a month. So to see that many and list that many was quite high. But I've just spent quite a significant sum sending out 2000 letters to high value homes in my area which has already generated me more opportunities but I didn't you know I'm coming into this month with nine forward booked vows that could see me through the entire month but I've decided not slowing down go again yeah and you're going to be in a healthy position now being able to choose the clients you want to work with um essentially as well so it puts you in a much stronger position doesn't it Yeah, so a top piece of advice I think would come out of what we've just shared there is when you hit that momentum, when you hit that kind of tipping point where your business is feeling like it's becoming organic, keep going. Don't slow down. Keep lead generating. Find alternative ways to serve it. So it might very well be that if you've been out hand delivering letters, start spending money on getting them posted. If you are doing one piece of social media content a day, Aim to do two. Posting to all the local groups daily. All of that sort of stuff. Really double down so that you pass that point where organic leads are coming. You're still generating lots at the front end. keep going it's so important isn't it because the organic leads you can't guarantee you can't guarantee where they're going to come from the networking or organic leads coming from social you can't always guarantee those you can't rely on recommendation referral you just can't it's a dangerous place to be and to run your business like that whereas if you can get an idea on the sort of numbers that a direct mail campaign could generate or the average door knocks that you might do would generate or digital lead generational methods, how much they generate, then you know what you need to invest to be able to get the returns back. So yeah, really important, I think, to do that consistently as well. Totally, totally agree. Now, this is one I know we aren't going to agree on. Less for argument's sake, there's someone out there, and I'm just going to pick a fictitious name. There's a guy called Jeff. And Jeff is sitting in a job and Jeff is miserable. Jeff is a branch manager. He is under immense pressure from his area manager to hit incredibly unrealistic targets. He's being told to go out and sit in customers living rooms and put 10 percent on the price to guarantee the listing and sign people up to five month contracts. And morally and ethically, Jeff is not loving life. Jeff wants out. The problem Jeff's got is Jeff's outgoings because he has a family. Jeff's outgoings are quite high and his income is isn't actually that great. Jeff's probably earning 40 grand a year, maybe 50 with a little bit of a bonus. But because of his lifestyle, he isn't able to save enough to get Jeff out of this world of pain. But Jeff is good. Jeff backs himself. Jeff believes he has the ability to become a self-employed agent and do very, very well and probably double his income in his first 18 months as a self-employed agent. But Jeff hasn't got the savings. Jeff's outgoings are 3K a month for ease of mind maths. Right. Jeff hasn't got nearly 30K in savings to allow him that eight to nine month runway. What can Jeff do? So this is where, as you said, our opinions will probably differ slightly. For me, Jeff... You knew where I was going with Jeff then, didn't you? Yeah, but for me, Jeff... Personally, I think having split jobs can reduce the output you can put into making your business a success. Whoa, whoa, whoa. No one said anything about a split job. I just asked, what could Jeff do? Well, Jeff, so there's two things I feel Jeff could do. Jeff could run his job and try and set his business on the side. Or Jeff could look to get finance and raise finance and raise capital. to allow him to step out of that role that he's in that he's really not enjoying and he's so miserable in, and then getting started in his new business, his self-employed estate agency business, and getting that off the ground with a startup loan. See, the only bit we differ on is I do believe that someone could supplement their income with a part-time job and... launch their self-employed business. I do believe it's possible, but I do believe it takes a certain type of person. Me personally, it wouldn't work. I'm very all or nothing. So for me, I haven't got the personality type that that would work because I would get frustrated by the fact that I've needed to do this part-time job. Um, Whereas certain personality types that are particularly organized, that can see the end in sight and they're doing it with a purpose to get them where they want to go. Fine. However, that we disagree on. You don't believe because of personality type that a part time job is a good idea. I do think that certain personalities could work. However, the thing we both totally agree on is if they raise the funding and raise the finance. through a startup loan, which for anyone listening, is a government backed scheme where you can raise funds to launch a new start business. We have created the process whereby if you wanted to raise that funding, the cash flow, the business plan, the personal survival budget, all of what we've built into our business to launch a new start is all of the paperwork, should you like, that you need to complete in order to apply for that. So in essence, you have the ability to apply for it just on the basis of partnering with us anyway. I do agree with Jack that that would be the best way to... Someone at the door, Jack. One second, mate. And that's the beauty of a live recording. So yeah, whilst Jack is getting the door... There is the ability to raise funding. It's not a particularly complex process. We've been through it a couple of times with a couple of our agents to help them raise the funding that they need. It took about eight weeks to complete the paperwork, go through the process and get everything set up. You can borrow up to 25K per director in the business. So if you were going into it as a partnership, as a duo, then you could borrow up to 50K. If it was a husband and wife partnership, again, 50K, but 25K per director. director and we did talk to one of the specialists that helps with preparing the paperwork to apply for the loan and their advice is if you apply for just under 15k then it's a much easier process there's a lot less compliance check should you like but we do believe that is probably the best way you know we've had a partner haven't we Jack that has remortgaged Because they were that set and intent on getting their business off the ground that they remortgaged. And it just so happens that with that added commitment that they've taken the finance out of their home to launch this, they are all in. They are committed. There isn't anything they're not doing every day to turn over every stone in order to build their business. And they're absolutely flying. They now have a pipeline that is the same value as their high street wage annually. And they've done it in eight weeks. They're committed to that process. There are a number of ways of raising the funds. It could be refinancing your house. It could be just taking an ordinary loan. It could be going through the process of the startup loan. But both of us, this is one thing we won't disagree on. There are businesses out there now that are offering to underpin agents and help them with their funding. Both of us agree that that's a very volatile way to launch your business. Yeah. And I suppose I can relate to that on a personal level because in the self-employed model that was in before now, we did have an underpin. And I'll be honest, the months that I had the underpin for, I wasn't motivated enough to go out there and generate opportunities and generate business because I knew I had that underpin. Yeah. Yeah, yeah, Purple Brick. So I think for the first three months we had an underpin. And yeah, I didn't, I'll be quite honest, I didn't generate enough business or I wasn't motivated enough to go out there and generate business because I knew I was going to get paid those months anyway. It was only when that underpin finished that I really thought, right, I need to get myself into gear now. I need to pull my socks up and I really need to start getting out there. But it meant I was three months behind where I could have been. So I think sometimes you need that bit of pressure, financial pressure to make sure you're going to go out there and generate business and opportunities. Well, pressure creates diamonds, right? I think the other thing to that as well is the flip side of that. So your experience was you felt you didn't feel particularly motivated because of the fact that you were being financially supported. But I think the flip side to that is what are you having to give up to receive that support? Because there's no business in the land that's just going to go, here's a few grand. Fill your boots without expectation of something in return. Does that then feel like you've got autonomy and freedom and choice as a self-employed entity? If you're being given money, there's going to be an expectation on you in return. And that's not to say that we don't have standards and expectations here at the Avenue, but it's very much a partnership. very much a collaboration but if we were giving people money there's no way that I would be comfortable with the idea that it's a it's it's a partnership no no I've invested in you so now I expect something in return I expect you to go and knock a certain number of doors I expect you to deliver a certain number of letters I expect you to show up on social media a certain number of times per day well that that's just jumping out of the frying pan into the flame surely Yeah, there's a big expectation then, isn't there? Yeah, you have to go out there and generate those results to make sure that the investment that they put in is going to have a return. Yeah, and the pressure is going to come either way because if there's been an upfront investment, there's going to be an expectation on a return on that investment. So why not have that investment secured with an external entity like a bank or the government, for example, where there isn't that internal pressure that you can just pay back on a monthly return And you've got that relationship. There's not that internal pressure where it's like, well, OK, you haven't converted enough of the leads that you have seen this month. So therefore, you know, you need to up the ante or really, you know, look at where you stand in the business. I just think the psychological impact there, the pressure changes. The pressure becomes about, oh, no, I'm indebted to you. And now it's OK for you to dictate to me what I need to do and when I need to do it. Yeah, and I think the bank's investment, there's plenty of banks out there, the startup loans or many other banks as well, that will offer the investment that you need to get started. And you run a business. So anyone for the love of God, I've seen several people on LinkedIn recently preaching that anyone that suggests that people should go out and get a business loan in order to launch their self-employed business is being unscrupulous or is being unethical. I mean, give your heads a wobble. If one of you, several people that I've seen on LinkedIn that have quoted that are listening in, please challenge me, please. And tell me that there's more than 90% of the business public, the business owning public that haven't gone and got startup funding or haven't raised capital in order to invest in their businesses. It blows my mind that people would say that it's unethical to suggest that someone goes and gets a loan to start their business. 90% of entrepreneurs borrow money in order to start a business. It's the way of business. And I think a lot of them do it because they want to stand on their own two feet. They want to go out there and create and set a business themselves and feel proud that when they've done it, that they've done it on their own. So, yeah, I think going out there and looking for cash flow in terms of banks or startup loans, I think is a great way to start. it's an entrepreneurial if anything if people haven't got the funding saved if someone then came to us and said look listen to you guys on the podcast I've listened I've read you your content and what have you I want to talk about raising funds to start my self-employed business I'm all in for supporting them because that shows a commitment that shows that they they want to go all in on this this isn't a if it doesn't work out, I've got a plan B. This is very much a, I want to build a successful business. I want to create financial freedom for me and my family. I want to be able to spend the summer holidays with my kids and not have to worry about money. That's the kind of person that we want to partner with. That's the person that gets it. They've got an entrepreneurial mindset and they want to go and win and succeed. And you've got other people. Really important as well, as we touched on earlier, to have alongside taking that loan, to have a robust plan in place. And if you've got those two things going side by side, then you know what you need to do to be able to repay those funds and kickstart your business. Absolutely. And the support. I think the community is a big thing. I think the support around you to help you. with the plan to help you remain committed to the journey, to remind you at times when you're going through the lows, because we all go through them. When you're going through the lows, that what you're working towards and how you can get there. And sometimes, you know, it, it's like driving a car or sailing a ship sometimes you have to realign the direction if you're driving a car and you know maps pops up and it's like there's roadworks ahead and you're going to be sitting in 20 miles of traffic but if you take this left turn here you can avoid the traffic that you add five minutes onto your journey you take the left turn and occasionally in business you've got to take that left turn yeah occasionally you've got to deviate ever so slightly from the pathway you're on and to have people around you that can help guide and support you with that is going to make the journey that much easier, which does connect to the finances. It does connect to the cash flow. It's not just one of my JHS tangent rants, but I do feel very strongly about the raising of funds. I do feel very strongly about people standing on their own two feet and being entrepreneurial rather than expecting that there'll be financial support available because that's a very dangerous place to be. What about setting up? The cost of setting up? I suppose for, well, all self-employed businesses should be set up correctly with the right AML, checks, TPO, having your own limited company set up, which we've worked out to be around £800, just under £1,000 in terms of set up costs. So if you make a side of grand for set up, then they should be covered then with a bit of change, shouldn't they? Yeah, £1,000 I think is more than enough to get your business launched and be fully compliant as well, which I think is very important. Totally agree. What do you then, a question around the cash flow process, what do you believe is the biggest risk to cash flow? What could cause someone to have issues? I think that the biggest thing is not having a planning place and just jumping into it without really fully understanding what it's going to take because I think for any self-employed business, the first six to 12 months, it is gonna be tough. And I don't think anyone, I don't think we could say it's all gonna be sunshines and rainbows. For the first six to 12 months, it will be tough for any business. Like any new business, no matter what industry you're in, it could be tough for the first six to 12 months to build the business up and build your cashflow. But I think having a really robust planning place, I think is probably really, really one of the most important things. The reason I was looking away temporarily then, because I was thinking as you were talking about it being tough, I was thinking about something I read the other day. I don't know whether it was in the James Clear email newsletter or where I read it, but it was very impactful. And it was this. So it was Dan Sullivan that said this quote. There's either going to be short term suffering or long term suffering. You choose. But either way, there will be suffering. And I think that's so true. And I think that's so true in so many ways. But I look at it and I think to myself, if I was still employed. That's long term suffering. And the reason that's long term suffering is because unless I'm at the absolute pinnacle of a business. And I'm earning really, really good money, which comes with its downside, because to be at the pinnacle of employed business, you've then got to have a lot of people working for you. Because you can't be at the pinnacle of an estate agency business and not have staff. And so then you might be earning six figures, but you're then piled with the stresses of serving those people. But either way, I still think you're going to be working until your retirement age or very close to. Right. But it comes with its stresses. That's long term suffering in my view. Whereas with what we do as self-employed agents, the short-term suffering is probably a year. Probably fair to say short-term suffering because you may bank after six months, but you've then got to continue to bank for months seven, eight, nine, 10, 11, and 12 to earn a decent enough income to see you into year two. I think once you hit the tipping point we talked about earlier, year two, all of a sudden you're massively out earning what you did when you were in your previous life. And then it's all about the snowball effect. Then it only gets as big as you want it to grow. You want to earn 200k a year? Great. Keep going. You want to earn half a million pound a year? Great. Triple down on what you were doing to the lead gen. Start to build a team around you to support you. But the reality is the short term 12 months of suffering can then lead to a lifetime of financial freedom. Yeah, definitely. And I love that quote. I quite often use short-term pain for long-term gain. I think that's what it's all about. And I suppose the short-term suffering as well, it is for me, and maybe I'm a little bit different or built a little bit different, but I actually really enjoyed those first five months. Yeah, the financial suffering was there. It was difficult financially, but I just loved the process. I loved the hustle. I loved the grind of it. I look, yeah, I just really started to enjoy the process. I think that's really important. I think people have got to enjoy the process and not focus so much on the results. And I think that's where coming back to Jeff, who is unsure, I think if people can love the process and have a long term vision, then it could potentially work no matter which way you go, whether it's the loan or the part time part time job. But I think a lot of people want quick results and quick wins. And if they're not seeing the results quick enough, they then might then start to switch off. So I think it's really important to have a robust plan and enjoy the process and not so much focused on the results. Just enjoy that process for those six to 12 minutes. I think it all comes back to that thing that we've both said, though, clarity. If you've got a plan and you know what you're doing and you've got your business plan, you've got your cash flow forecast, you've got all of those bits in place that give you that peace of mind. And if ever you're feeling the wobble, you just refer back to the plan and go, that's what I'm working towards. All I've got to do is stick to that. And if I continue to stick to that, then I can love the process. I don't think people can love the process if they're coming into an environment where there's no plan because you become a bit frantic. And I made those mistakes. My personality type, I'm not a natural planner. I'm a doer. So I'll go out and do loads of stuff. That was my instinct when we first launched the business as an agent. We had a plan for the avenue and what we wanted to do. But as an agent, my instincts took over and I just went out and wanted to do lots of stuff. But I very quickly learned that that isn't a viable route to success. So my instincts are to just go and do lots of stuff, work hard. Very Western culture. Just put loads of hours in. If you put loads and loads and loads and loads of hours in, surely something will come good. Whereas actually, I then realised I need a plan. I don't need loads of hours. I need more productivity. And as soon as I devised the plan, I'm like, this is actually, I'm never going to coin the phrase easy, but it was a hell of a lot easier then. And I think since we've, I suppose, just in our onboarding processes, the back end of last year, the success of Simple Managing just shows that having a robust planning place and the businesses that they've built up in their, I think, six weeks. And we've got Henry and Emily that are now at eight weeks. The business and the cash flow, I suppose, in terms of the opportunities they've got in their business now that they've built just shows that having the right plan and also weekly strategic planning meetings or meetings fortnightly strategic planning meetings to tweak and refine those things will make sure that yeah the business keeps running and succeeding lots of gold in there I think there's lots that people can take away if there are anybody if there's anybody out there that's feeling a bit like jeff then just reach out. Contact Neil Jack. We'll talk you through. It may very well be that we go through the process with you, talk you through the business planning, the cash flow in this personal survival budget, how you can generate your leads, how you can get your business wheels turning quickly. And you might get to the end of that process and go, do you know what? I appreciate I can raise the funds. I appreciate that there's a blueprint. I appreciate there's a plan to succeed. But it's not for me. That's cool. That's cool. If you're feeling like Jeff, you're feeling suffocated, you're feeling trapped, you feel like there's never going to be an opportunity where you can have choice over what you do in your life and you haven't got that freedom. Then contact us and we're happy to give advice, even if it doesn't lead to a conversation around the avenue. It might be that you decide to go off and do something else. That's what we see as our duty with the Elite Agent Masterclass is to help people get to the elite level that they deserve to be at. So our phones are always on. Our DMs are always open. Feel free to contact us. I really enjoyed that episode, Jack. Yeah, it's good. It's good. Apologies for the interruption that we got there. It's cool. It's cool. You know, we handled it like pros. Yeah, you did, mate. You managed to do a good job. Until next time, that is another episode of the Elite Agent Masterclass. Thanks for tuning in. If you have any questions about any part of the process that we've discussed either in today's episode or in previous episodes, feel free to contact us. Our contact details will be in the show notes. Until next time.